Tagged With "Stopwatch"

Topic

Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Wintertime boredom, but then I remembered that I had two stopwatches, and what could be more fun than running them against each other to see if they read the same after an hour or so? Well, they showed different times at the end. Enough to matter? YES! Using either watch, you could be more than 0.1 second off at the finish in just about any speed class. They're both Robic SC-500, kind of the standard ORR stopwatch. So what to do about the difference? Being too technically challenged to do a...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Owen Green ·
Ok well Tom I have my new timer. Its a lot like the other ones that I wore on my left wrist ,but when I run it will be taped to my mirror. O
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Asa Jay Laughton ·
So Tom.... where were those stopwatches made? Have you tried any non-electronic stopwatches? You know, those antique analog wound-spring types? It would be interesting to see how far off they were from your temperature-compensated crystal standard. Currently I use GPS timing, in a "hope" that it's really close to the same GPS timing being used in the race. Asa
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Robic watches are made by MBI ("Master Builders Inc.") in Fort Collins, Colorado, but the watches themselves are, of course, assembled in China. AJ, I think your strategy of using GPS timing is really good, especially that I now know how far off the electronic stopwatches can be. As for mechanical, well, I think they'd be worse unless it was something from Rolex maybe - but then that would be worth more than my car ;-). Mr. Bauer probably has us all beat with his egg timer... he's definitely...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Charlie Friend ·
OK, I made the same test. The watches are different brands (Robic and Acutrak) but both look identical and are both SC-500 models so I'm pretty sure that they are the "same". I forgot them and let them run for 2 hrs and 21 min. The error between them after that time was .06 sec. This error could easily be due to my starting and stopping. Who knows. At any rate pretty darn close. I don't think any mechanical stopwatch would ever be a good choice since I do think that temperature would affect...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Charlie, thank you! Mine were much farther out, so maybe I should buy a new watch or at least test with new batteries. Or maybe I should just buy one of your watches!
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Put in fresh batteries, got same result. Black watch showed 2:47:37.025 and Red watch showed 2:47:36.378. Charlie, wanna sell me a good watch?
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Asa Jay Laughton ·
Are you using calibrated cesium-beam reverse-oscillating Lithium-metal-hydride batteries? No? Well then... -there's- the problem. That or one of your thumbs is shorter than the other and is 0.647 seconds faster at pressing the start button. Asa Jay
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Bauer ·
Tom if you use the rd one and at 2:47:36.378 I really think you will be disqualified for being tooooooooooo slow
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Hate when an Unlimited guy calls me slow. And 'cause it's true makes it worse
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Bauer ·
You know Tom just as long as our watch is accurate at 30 minutes or less you will be just fine. If you calculate the error back to 30 minutes from your 2 hours and 45 minutes your should be ok.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Gee, Dave, you're pretty smart for an Unlimited guy! Of course I calculated the % error and applied it to the target times for the lower speeds - and that's how I determined that depending on either one of my stopwatches would probably leave me out of first place and wishing I had one of Charlie's super-accurate watches. Or else wishing I had your courage so that precise timing didn't matter ;-)
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Ken Rees ·
Tom, how did you start and stop the watches? I have done a similar test with my two electronic digital watches and there was always a slight difference, but I assume the difference was caused by me. Possible variables: left hand verses right hand. the button mechanism, one thumb fatter than the other, etc. The variable causing error may be magnified or cancel out during the start and stop sequence. Unless you can start and stop the watches with the same mechanism, you are introducing other ...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Bauer ·
I have an idea, 2 test. 1st one run them for a some time, record the difference. 2nd test change hands and then see if the same watch is the slow one?
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Bauer ·
Just a question Tom, how far are they off for your target in your 120 class you ran last Sept.?
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Hey Ken and Dave, thanks. Here's my procedure: I put one watch in each hand and start each with the respective index finger. I was worried about different starting times, so I performed the test a number of times and got very consistent results even when I switched hands. The ratio between the two watches is 0.9999356 within a very small range. Now that may not seem like much of a difference, but if you multiply it by the number of seconds in your target time (e.g., 2160 seconds for 150...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Asa Jay Laughton ·
... and how sore your index fingers are. Asa
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Mike Laiserin ·
Tom, the red Robic you gave me must've been the one with the perfect timing. LOL Is this what you all do in winter? (sigh) I've got a car to to assemble...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Mike, good luck on your car assembly project. If I had your mechanical skills, I might be doing something that impressive too, but as it is, I'm just starting and stopping my lousy watches. Long way to May.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Berry Lowman ·
Tom - Kudos on a great pot-stirring topic to shake off the wintertime blues! Fewer subjects may spark more furious debate on any ORR forum than stopwatch variance. It's got to be right up there with asking what brand of oil enthusiasts prefer, or which brand of tires are best to run. No matter who you ask, their answer will always be a bit different. Yet, according to a book I read, the answer to all questions in the universe should clearly be 42. Of course! In my humble opinion, the answer...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Hey Berry Ricky Bobby - a C6 Z06 in exchange for your obviously-super-accurate stopwatch? Sounds like a very good deal! And you're right about any old topic being good enough to stir the pot during these winter doldrums - even stopwatch accuracy. Hope someone else has a more interesting thread to start
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Berry Lowman ·
Tom - I like my chances on picking the correct 6 numbers a bit better than anyone swapping a C6 Z06 for my stopwatch, but either is worth a shot, eh? What could ever be more exciting than tires, oil, or a good ol' fashioned timing discussion? Probably nothing! That said, something I bet even more folks would love to hear about is the difference between traditional stopwatch button pushing vs the King Compumaster 3000R? Now THAT could make for some stimulating conversation! Looking forward to...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Hey Berry, you want a job as a marketing whiz at Silkrip? I mean wow, the "Compumaster 3000"! Just so you know, Bunny is thinking of picking a charity in Ely to raffle off a Silkrip ORR Computer at NORC 2017. So you have a chance to find out first-hand the difference between your stopwatch and the CompuThingy at very little cost! And yes, Berry, we're thinking of trying the new 155 mph class - let's see, lower the car a bit, screw up my courage more than a bit, reprogram the CompuBomb, and...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Bauer ·
Sounds like you two may have a challenge going on here.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Berry Lowman ·
Tom - Having you in the 155 will be awesome! I always say, the greater the talent in the class, the sweeter the thrill of victory will be to whomever stands atop the podium! Plus, who doesn't want a shot at a FREE case of Mountain Dew?!? #DoTheDew Funny enough, marketing & promotion is what I do. That said, these days, I only agree to pitch things I know I like, so if the Compumaster 3000R needs a spokesperson, I'd love to give it a whirl sometime to see how it fares! Dave - Join us in...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Lanny Lowman ·
Before my navigator ( yes I know I let him drive last September, he won his class and I have created a monster) gets too carried away with the challenges, as Dave said, I am the Driver and the only challenge from the 466 car will be for everyone to have a safe and enjoyable trip down 318 no matter which class you decide to run in or which "Egg Timer" or "Mountain Dew and Snickers" you decide to use. BTW, count me in for some of those Raffle Tickets for the CompuBomb, Compumaster 3000R...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Lanny, I wish you the best in the raffle! Thanks for the vote of confidence. With you driving and Berry navigating, you'll definitely make the 155 mph class tough on everyone else! Drat.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Owen Green ·
I keep telling youse guys, watch out if Owen gets enough money to run, then that crazy course worker just might surprise all of you
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Looked at current Robic offerings - the SC-505W which used to read to the millisecond now only reads to the hundredth of a second - with no change in model number or price or even, in some cases, description. Buyers beware! Now to modern technology. I looked at the iPhone standard clock application, and it reads to the 0.01 second - but it at least can be periodically synced with the GPS atomic clock if you ensure that Settings - General - Date & Time - "Set Automatically" is turned on.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Hoppie ·
Here is the stopwatch I use at work for calibrations: https://www.fishersci.com/shop...nt-stopwatch/s90210# It seems pretty accurate, and I would guess a lot better than the ones I've been using in OR Racing ... BUT ! With Jim beating me up with 0.0054 results ... the stop watch isn't my problem ~DaVe
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

jimburnett ·
Dave, You and Aaron are a class act. I always enjoy seeing you both at the races. As for timing in these TSD rallies, in my opinion, the whole run is determined at the start line ie: reaction time to start your watch. I have done hours of practice to determine my reaction time and have a range of 0.05 to 0.175 seconds. I therefore try to cross the finish line 0.1 secs early. I got lucky at SSCC. Probably will never happen again!! Jim
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Jim Burnett has it right - aim to be a bit early to compensate for the delay time at the start. And he did it amazingly well in September, driving solo, using a stopwatch, and achieving 0.0054 secs off perfect. And Dave, the stopwatch you referenced is just 0.01 second resolution, so Jim's time would be well inside that. Scary. In any case, there should be a separate class for hand timers and maybe a separate one yet for Jim.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Dave Hoppie ·
Jim is definitely an awesome competitor and great value to the ORR community ! We still laugh about the story all the time when we got the grid sheet in Sept. and only had 3 entries in our class, then I think we both looked at the other names and had the same OH SHIT! moment at the same time, when we saw it was Jim and Angel ... FUN STUFF ! ~DaVe
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Owen Green ·
yeah gonna beat the high dollar computers and stopwatches with a $38 timex. oops too late Tom Owen has read it . wound up with a 67 merc cat in the back yard ,with a 70 351C with 71,2v heads now to come up with the money to reassemble and put the large plumbing inside gotta find a front clip and pass door. then eye might have a black cat to play with.. see ya all soon O ps. I must be confused a Mopar fan that drives Chevys and winds up working with Ford race teams I must be confused I wind...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Simon Gibbons ·
You've got me thinking now! It's cold and dark, so I'm not trekking down to the garage tonight (Steven Donegan can confirm it's a long way), but tomorrow I'm definitely opening up the Big Bag for some tests.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Simon, as you may be able to tell, you're in for a thrill. Nothing beats rummaging around in a big bag-o-stopwatches to find a gem.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Owen Green ·
found out the other day that the guy that I am storing that cougar for has the rest of the sheet metal. now I have to come up with the time and money to reassemble that cat and go hunting.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Tom King ·
Owen, we'll be looking for that Cougar with the big engine and the Timex watch strapped to the rear view mirror! Good luck with the time and money thing! By the way, I did buy a new stopwatch, and it seems to be very accurate (unlike my other two). I'm still not in the same league with Simon in terms of number of watches in the Big Bag, but at least I have one that is not embarrassingly far off.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Owen Green ·
big engine naw just a small block with big heads
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Bjoern Flesland ·
Yesterday at the awards we learned that our time scoring was 1.2590 seconds off target/late. But our stop watch indicated 0.46 secs off/late at the finish line. We really don't understand how it became 1.2590 seconds off. That's a big difference IMO. Are we starting getting slow here, or can an old stopwatch battery simply slow down the Robic stopwatch? Any wise heads here that can explain this mismatch?
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

jimburnett ·
Bjoern, I had a finish line reading on my stopwatch of .1 sec early in the 140 class. Thought I was in the hunt since I figure on a .1 sec reaction to start my watch. Much to my surprise my result time was 54.8 seconds early!! The car in front of me was 5 secs late so according to timing and scoring I should have finished on his bumper. Never saw him! I expect transparency from timing and scoring to resolve this error and to post their resolution of it here. I know of other competitors who...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Lanny Lowman ·
Jim, I remember seeing you come to the finish pits and there was no one directly in front of you there either.
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Bjoern Flesland ·
Jim, The SSCC results are now online. Realize you got a third place in your speed class with a time variance of 0.3481 secs. Congratulations!!! Just curious, what happened with your timing and scoring? How did it become wrong initially? Are you perhaps able to share detailed information about this? Cheers Bjoern
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

jimburnett ·
Bjoern, Dave with timing & scoring saw the error after I pointed it out to him after the dinner. He said something about human error in posting the prelim results. That's as far as the explanation went. Since they corrected my time in a timely way, I didn't follow up with him to explain in detail what "human error" meant. As for your original post about stopwatches, yes as we age our reaction time is probably not as quick as it was when younger. I've tested my reaction time using a stop...
Reply

Re: Stopwatch Errors

Doug Masters ·
Since I'm the guy you bumped to 4th I'm going to get my times checked as well. My stopwatch showed .09 late, and that jives with my timer. I know what half a second looks like and I don't think I was that late. At BBORR this year I knew I was around .5 late just by timer, actual time came in at .57. Never the less, if the hardware is yours then I'll send it to you. If it isn't mine then I don't want it.
×
×
×
×